Greg McDonough is the Managing Partner at Blackburn Capital Advisors, a firm specializing in transforming finance and accounting practices for multimillion-dollar organizations. With extensive experience in the professional services sector, Greg has guided companies through turnarounds, mergers, and acquisitions as a Certified Insolvency and Restructuring Advisor. He is the author of The Turnaround, a practical guide for businesses navigating financial challenges. Greg also serves as the President of the Entrepreneurs’ Organization Washington, DC Chapter and is a member of several business and trade associations. His commitment extends beyond business, as he is an eight-time Ironman finisher and hosts the Chief Endurance Officer podcast, blending his professional expertise with his passion for endurance sports.
Endurance sports demand discipline and resilience — qualities that can significantly impact leadership and strategic decision-making in business. How can executives apply these principles to overcome professional challenges?
Greg McDonough, a financial strategist and seasoned Ironman competitor, emphasizes the similarities between training for endurance sports and managing a business. He highlights that just as consistent, disciplined training leads to improved performance in sports, a similar focused and systematic approach to financial management can transform how companies navigate challenges and seize opportunities. By employing meticulous financial analysis and strategic planning, Greg enables executives to make informed decisions, ensuring both immediate stability and long-term business growth.
In this episode of America Open for Business, host Cameron Heffernan welcomes Greg McDonough, Managing Partner at Blackburn Capital Advisors, to discuss blending endurance with business savvy. They explore how the principles of endurance training apply to effective business management, the importance of financial literacy for non-financial executives, and strategies for using financial insights to drive business growth.
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Narrator: 0:03
Welcome to America Open for Business, where we talk with high-growth entrepreneurs and leaders who have found success in one of the world’s most important markets.
Cameron: 0:14
Hello everybody and welcome to America Open for Business. I’m the host, Cameron Heffernan, and welcome to the show. Today’s episode in our Founders and Owners series is brought to you by your B2B marketing. That’s us. We are a truly global marketing agency. Many mid-market B2B companies. They face challenges as they enter new markets, whether expanding across borders or working in areas outside of their home region. We handle end-to-end marketing, from strategy all the way through to execution, and that gives our clients the freedom to focus on customer growth and not marketing initiatives. You can discover how we can drive your expansion by visiting our website. That’s yourb2bmarketingco, not com Past.
Cameron: 0:58
Guests of this show, america Open for Business, have included Brian Smith, the founder of the UGG brand of boots, the billion-dollar consumer footwear brand, and Ben Tija, founder and CEO of Earthly Wellness, a $20 million-plus e-commerce wellness company here in Ohio. Today’s guest, who I’m very happy to welcome to the show close friend of mine, greg McDonough he is the founder of Blackburn Capital Advisors. Greg is a seasoned executive and Ironman triathlete We’ll get a lot into that today too who has owned and operated businesses in the professional services sector, helping them navigate through good and tough times. Greg is the host of the Chief Endurance Officer podcast and an eight-time Ironman finisher. Is that the right number?
Greg: 1:47
It is Working on number nine. Awesome. Well, welcome to the show, greg Great Cameron. Pleasure to be here. I’m really excited for our conversation.
Cameron: 1:55
Yeah, me too. I’m going to jump right in. I like to start the show with a very broad question, and you can run with it every way you would like. How do you help people, how does your company help clients?
Greg: 2:07
Certainly, and I appreciate you asking that question.
Greg: 2:09
So I help, we help business executives, association executives, fill their financial blind spot.
Greg: 2:15
You know many of us as entrepreneurs, we start a business, it starts growing. All of a sudden we’ve got employees, we’ve got marketing budgets, we’ve got lists and lists of things to do and we spend a lot of our time sort of running our business instead of working on our business. And so what I do is I free up time for those executives to spend more time on their business and less time in their business with the concept of hey, I’ve seen millions and millions of financial statements, I’ve seen hundreds of different companies and I could short circuit or time collapse, the time required for an executive or an association director to sort of understand their financials and the story that it’s telling or not telling. And I could also bridge that gap between, again, the marketplace or if they’re dealing with an issue with their CPA or they’ve got an issue with the bank or an opportunity. I can help play that middle person role and really free up a lot of time and provide them some confidence in their data.
Cameron: 3:16
Without you, what would they be facing potentially?
Greg: 3:20
Ask that one more time.
Cameron: 3:22
Without your services and your expertise, what issues could they be facing?
Greg: 3:26
Yeah, great question. Another good question they could be making business decisions off of incorrect data. It wasn’t reconciled properly, or they’re behind on their bookkeeping, or there’s something on the balance sheet that really shouldn’t be there, that needs to be pushed through the income statement, and we can get into all those details. But at the end of the day, if they were using or looking at their financials, that financial statement statements could be telling a story that is untrue about their business, and so they run the risk of again making a business decision based on faulty data and therefore that decision has a higher probability of failing.
Cameron: 4:13
Can you walk us through how a client engagement might look? Someone reaches out to you, and where do they usually start? What kind of a pain point can they initially express to you of a?
Greg: 4:23
pain point can initially express to you. The kickoff generally is a point of frustration. A point of frustration that they’re not using their financials or the story that they’re interpreting from their story. The big question is this, cameron they get to the end of the year and they see all this profit and then they look in their bank account and there’s no money in the bank. Well, where is it?
Greg: 4:46
And it could be, they took distributions and they forgot about it. It could be that it’s sitting on the balance sheet and accounts receivables that are really aren’t collectible, so therefore that really, truly is an income for their business and so the profitability is false. And so it tends to be that I. I’ve also a lot of my clients that come to me expect their CPAs to provide this type of service, and they come to me in frustration and say hey, greg, my CPA isn’t providing me any sort of month-to-month support, and nor should they. They very much focus on tax preparation, compliance and those types of things unless that relationship has been articulated. But most CPAs won’t provide you the white glove, hand-holding service of truly understanding and a bit of part of my process, I’m also educating my clients, and so, as we walk through a monthly financial analysis or a quarterly strategic plan, we’re talking about what inputs create what outputs through their financial statements and so that we can predict behaviors or predict future outcomes, because we know we’re doing X and Y on a weekly, monthly basis.
Cameron: 5:57
I’ve heard it said before that a bookkeeper and a CPA is more about what has happened in the past, what has transpired. A CFO focuses more on going forward and what’s coming down the pike. Do you agree with that?
Greg: 6:08
A hundred percent.
Cameron: 6:10
So it’s going to help me make better, more informed business decisions based on what actual cashflow projections look like Pipeline. They may be coming in to say, yeah, we can afford to hire this new, whatever the position is, or we should hold off on that new employee benefit, whatever that might be.
Greg: 6:27
That’s exactly right, and I do that through several different mechanisms. I’ll give you an illustration. One of the pillars that I stand on with my clients is I want my businesses, my clients, to have three months worth of operating cash in reserves, free and clear of debt. And the reason for that is one if an opportunity presents itself and we need to put some gas on the fire to get there, then we’ve got gas for the fire. And two, it helps with going back to that business decision-making. If I’ve got $50,000 in the bank, free and clear of all debt obligations, and I want to hire a $50,000 employee, I know I’ve got six months worth of runway at least to cover any. If that hire turned out to be a bad hire, Granted, you wouldn’t wait the full six months and burn down your total reserve. But it gives you a little bit more confidence in making those decisions because you’ve got a cash reserve in the bank.
Cameron: 7:19
Okay, I’ve heard that magic number of three months of cost, whether it’s payroll or COGS that’s in the bank set aside that you really should use as a guideline. Is that something you advise your clients on as well?
Greg: 7:35
And I tend to focus on operating expenses. So I don’t worry about the cost of good soul, because that tends to ebb and flow with your revenue Like. The scenario would be that you know you close your week on a Friday and Monday morning you’ve got no more clients and you’ve got zero. So how much cash do you have to keep the lights on, to pay the rent, to pay the employees, so that you can rejuvenate your business?
Cameron: 7:56
Okay, at the outset you mentioned that you work with both companies and associations, very different kinds of animals. What are good profile of the type of client that you’d work with. You can look at each of those if you’d like. You know a good, a good, ideal customer profile for you.
Greg: 8:14
Yeah, thank you for asking that. So on the company side it tends I tend to work mostly with the CEO, business owner or the executive team and I’m filling that strategic financial role. And it can be either on an interior designer, a studio that’s got three or four designers and he or she just doesn’t want to spend the time to understand and learn their financials. So I sit on their shoulder and I help one with the understanding of what’s going on, sort of month in and month out, and to sort of managing the bookkeeper and then going forward providing information for the CPA. So that’s a very typical client and I call that financial management coaching. So I’m really playing a role of a coach versus doing a lot of work On the other side of the coin, from the fractional CFO perspective that can.
Greg: 9:09
A typical assignment for that would be an association that either their systems are far behind, their financial management systems are outdated and they need to do an upgrade, or the team they have in place isn’t the team they want to have going forward.
Greg: 9:24
And it’s a type of role that you can’t sort of put on a plan.
Greg: 9:28
You can’t walk into your CFO’s office or your controller’s office and say, hey, greg, I’m going to put you on a six-month plan and if you don’t sort of shape up, we’re going to find somebody else.
Greg: 9:39
That’s obviously a red flag and that person will be looking for work quickly and they’ve got their fingers on a lot of different parts of the organization. So the role that I’ve played a couple of times is hey, we’re going to make a dramatic shift in our finance and accounting group today. Greg, tomorrow can you show up and be on site and kind of get your fingers into the dam and get control of the checking accounts and the payroll process and all those things? And that tends to be, you know, a couple months worth of work and we find the next replacement. So I don’t look to stay there forever, but that’s a typical assignment in sort of the association space I’ve also fulfilled a role in which, again, they just need a group needs a little extra firepower in the finance and accounting and strategy side. Maybe there’s an opportunity to grow non-member revenue or make an acquisition, which is becoming more common now in the association nonprofit space and those types of things. So it can also play as an extra set of hands when needed.
Cameron: 10:37
So you’re also making strategic not just about the finances but strategic advisory recommendations for acquisitions, new areas to invest with the association or the company, absolutely okay. Do you think often or often do you feel that companies sometimes put too much I don’t know faith in the ability of an in-house bookkeeper accountant to provide that kind of cfo function and role when they’re not equipped to do so?
Greg: 11:06
Yeah, I’d say so. I think the executive doesn’t know what they don’t know and they probably don’t look at their financials as a tool they look at. To your point you made earlier about the looking backwards, they’re looking at their financials as what was the score of the game that ended last night. Well, yeah, that’s important and those trends are important for sure, but at the end of the day, you’re not going to influence what the score of the game was last night after the game has ended and they get used to that and they don’t see that their financials and projections and cash flow management can really be used as a way to grow and make your business healthier.
Cameron: 11:46
Okay, so anyone who visits your site or follows you on LinkedIn or checks you out will notice you do a lot of content creation, thought leadership around endurance leadership. Can you tell us a bit about what that is and how it came to be?
Greg: 12:01
Yeah, and this is where you make me smile. So it’s a combination of my passion for leadership you know, working with CEOs running my own business. I owned and operated a business for about six years prior to doing this work. So my passion for entrepreneurship, leadership, and my passion for endurance racing. So my wife and I do Ironman races, you mentioned in the intro.
Greg: 12:25
It’s a lifestyle for us. It allows us to travel the world with our kids. It allows us to show and illustrate sort of a healthier lifestyle and to do non-healthy things from time to time. But and I, for some reason, it’s just always been an itch for me to create content around endurance leadership, to create. I can see myself being on a Ted stage at some point talking about the principles. And, if you think about it, it’s not just endurance from a racing perspective, right, we all have different types of endurance. If it’s, you know, standing up a new business, or if you’re a senior executive at Google, there are times through your life that you need to endure to get to your passion, to get to your goals, to get to your goals, to get to your personal why. And it’s those types of stories that I’m trying to bring out from people through this endurance leadership platform.
Cameron: 13:17
Can you share one or two of those kinds of examples with us?
Greg: 13:21
Yeah, I’ll use myself for an example. So my previous company I took it through, or we took it through a chapter 11 bankruptcy process and at the beginning of that process, or even making the decision to go into that process, it was scary, right. It’s people going to look down on us, are customers still going to continue, will the employees leave? What will the vendors do? And after we made that decision to do it, I became sort of enthralled in learning everything I could about the process. So I went and sat and got my certification for insolvency and restructuring so I could help manage us through the process. And I get to the end of it and I wrote my first book about a second book about this.
Greg: 14:01
When you get to the end of the process, you realize that it’s all about setting small goals, keeping your eye on the long-term objective, being flexible and it’s. Those principles are very similar to endurance racing, right. So we, when we train for an Ironman, it’s a nine-month program and week one we’re running three miles and we’re swimming, you know, a quarter mile. By week 40, it’s a different story, right, we’re spending the weekend exercising, and so that would be an illustration of an endurance endeavor sort of in business and relating it also to triathlon.
Cameron: 14:37
Okay. So I think implicit in that is we’re with you to work with you through the long-term. We’re not just here for a couple months and then we’re out. It’s being fiscally responsible and supporting a growing business is an ongoing long-term endeavor. That’s a being fiscally responsible and supporting and growing business is an ongoing, you know, long-term endeavor.
Greg: 14:52
That’s right, that’s exactly right. And also doing the work when nobody’s watching, right, doing what you need to be doing when nobody’s pushing you and nobody’s holding you accountable. It’s you, if you’re training, right, it’s that 5am swim that you want to, that you need to get in, that you can’t. Or you’re training right, it’s that 5 am swim that you need to get in, that you can’t or you don’t want to. But you get yourself out of bed at 4.30 to get to the pool. And same with business right, we’ve got things in our business that need to get done and we either got to find, outsource people to help us with that or do it ourselves. But no one’s really telling us that it needs to get done or holding us accountable for the finer points and those you know. Endurance leadership, to me, is doing that work when nobody’s watching Interesting.
Cameron: 15:39
I think there’s a lot of parallels and you and I have talked about this before with what you offer as a service and what we offer to our clients as an agency, that you know the concept of you could go, do all this yourself. You could be your own bookkeeper, your own accountant, you could run your own payroll, you could send and receive every invoice, you could do your own financial projections. You could do all those things. How are you then going to go and run your business in addition to all that stuff, unless it’s your passion? And our pitch to clients and prospects is you’re better off doing what helps to grow the business the best and gives you the most personal energy than focusing on sending out marketing campaigns and writing white papers and doing tweets. Is that accurate?
Greg: 16:19
Absolutely accurate and a story came to mind. So I work with an interior designer out of New York City and we’ve been working together now for, I think, three years and when we first started it was too much credit card cash flow sort of randomness, a lot of worry and risk when you come up to sort of tax time like how much am I going to owe the IRS or how much am I responsible for. And so we put in a program that’s very much like the Profit First program from Mike Michalowicz where, say, every dollar comes in, we’re going to put a little bit away for profit, a little bit away for income tax and so on, so on, and fast forward 12 months, we get to tax season and she sends me a note saying Greg, this is my favorite tax season ever and nobody likes tax season.
Narrator: 17:06
And I said why is that?
Greg: 17:11
She goes. Well, I owe the IRS $25,000 and I’ve got $30,000 in the bank and she’s like so no worry, right, it’s just write the check, move on. So that alleviates a lot of time and stress and worry for her, so that she could be doing business development during those months that she would have normally been scrounging around looking for pennies to sort of put towards this liability. So it’s my favorite story. I’m waiting for my next favorite story to appear, but that’s a good one.
Cameron: 17:38
How did you get into that as a vertical area? Sorry, interior design.
Greg: 17:44
Yeah, that’s a great question. It kind of as my coach would say, you know you walk through the doors that are open. And so when I put out my shingle to do the financial, the fractional CFO work, I had a very large assignment at an association and then within my forum I was also talking about putting out my this business and financial management consulting and one of my forum mates has a friend who’s this person out of New York and her and I connected and started that relationship. And then my coach has another friend who’s an interior designer and so the sort of the word of mouth started to come to me. Also, around that same time, through our entrepreneurs organization, someone out of North Carolina chapter reached out looking for a person that has got nonprofit experience and mergers and acquisitions. So I raised my hand and all of a sudden I’m introduced to the American Society of Interior Designers. That turned into a small project. The CEO at the time asked me to join their board as a pro bono, sort of ad hoc role. So I said, yes, I’ve just started my business looking to get involved with this community because it’s a fun community.
Greg: 18:55
Then the pandemic hit. So it’s an assignment that I needed to stick through and one thing led to the other. I spent three years on their board and really now have a great relationship within this industry, but again, it was just kind of I love their creativity. I enjoy walking into a home and seeing things in the right places. My home does not look like that, but I do enjoy seeing others. So, yeah, it’s something I just really enjoy and I guess it’s gravitating to me.
Cameron: 19:23
Well, I think also you have more value to them, to the future interior designers you’ll be working with, because you have comps from the past to draw from. You have very specific industry experience. I mean I love the concept of working with and through associations in so many different ways. As a marketing professional and advisor, a lot of our clients will try to get them into media partnerships or sponsorships or packages through an association because the fit is so specific and then you know they can go to a trade show associated with that group. They can have an ongoing partner content relationship.
Greg: 19:57
It’s a win-win on so many levels that’s right, yeah, in fact, an opportunity opened up for me, so ASID asked me to speak at one of their conferences to do a 30-minute financial management talk.
Greg: 20:08
You know what are the three things that I see most interior designers not doing, and it was pretty well intended and got a pretty good review and that led into a speaking opportunity in Chicago and then led into somebody calling me that’s hosting a conference in May which I’m out of the country for. But it’s this luxury design summit up in Nantucket which I was like. This is amazing, just the phone’s ringing versus me outbound calling. One thing leads to the another leads to the other. And so back to your point about marketing through associations.
Cameron: 20:42
It’s a great strategy. Well, now we’re talking about marketing, so tell me what. What did you find most effective recently in your own outreach? More outbound, inbound referral. What’s been working?
Greg: 20:51
Yeah, I am almost 100% referral on the financial management side of what I do. You also, I think, mentioned that I run a podcast, and I’m finding that running my podcast is opening doors that I wouldn’t be able to would have taken me a long, long time to the traditional way, right, either the cold call or the email or the LinkedIn drip, or you name it. You know having a pocket, and, granted, it’s a significant investment, as you know, but that is getting me to audiences that I wouldn’t have had opportunities to get in front of, and that’s either hasn’t resulted in work or business or, you know, revenue yet, but it’s the first layer of conversations, and then some of those guests are then introducing me to sort of buyers of what I do, and so it’s been a really good tool.
Cameron: 21:44
What other marketing techniques have been effective? You know you’re active on LinkedIn and you’re active with your blog and things content that you push out there. What topics have been most resonant with your different audiences?
Greg: 21:56
Yeah, I’d say the biggest from a marketing perspective. I organized a drip campaign targeted to interior designers and architects, ironically for the employee retention tax credit. Architects, ironically for the employee retention tax credit. And this was probably I don’t know almost three years ago, before everybody else was calling you and texting you and I had a small drip campaign and that you know it was a sequence, I believe, of five different emails. It was personalized, related to my experience with the interior design space, so there was some familiarity. You know you got the occasional email of hey, drop me off your list. But you know, out of 100, I’d probably get five conversations and out of those five I’d get two clients, and so it worked. It worked really well Until, again, I got inundated by everybody else and now I was just part of the noise. But that was a tool that we created and implemented that really works well.
Cameron: 22:54
I love that. I mean there’s elements here to break down that I think pointed to that success. First of all, 5% response rate and a 2% conversion rate pretty good. And you were very specific. At a time when the need was very acute. People needed to get PPP funding or retention credit. You know, help and people most. I remember going through that I didn’t want to do it myself, you know and the fact that you’re there to help them and is useful, specific to their industry. You can mention that you’ve worked with others in the interior design space and that immediacy of it’s a pain point that is so sharp. Hey, here’s someone who’s going gonna help me navigate this right away. It’s hard to turn that down.
Greg: 23:36
And also the kicker for me was articulating my process as well. So I wrote my content in a way that showed that it wasn’t just me sitting in a dark room doing ERTC applications just fly by night. I put them sort of on the letterhead as well. So there was a team, there was a process, there was, you know, experience versus where many of the inbound marketing we’re getting around ERTC now are really processing mills and they’re just looking for volume. My process was very specific and, you know, targeted to having a thorough output, you know, from the analysis of the gross receipts down to how the forms were filed and then reviewed by an outside party. I felt like that gave me a little bit of a leg up for somebody to call Another nice concept partnership with another provider in a similar but complimentary space.
Cameron: 24:36
You can broaden your reach. You can hit both your database as well as theirs, and the end-to-end service you’re able to provide is wider. And then you’ve also built a nice referral pipeline with that partner going forward.
Greg: 24:51
That’s right.
Cameron: 24:53
We work with groups and for this year we’re going to lean more into this. We’re talking about niches and identifying where you best fit. We’re working with more overseas headquartered companies that are still in the B2B space within manufacturing and industrials, and our sweet spot is working with companies that are based overseas and have some function here sales, distribution, or maybe one person who’s running the business but don’t have the marketing function, don’t have the marketing department. If you were to work with a company that is in that kind of a mold where their heart is overseas, they’re based offshore and they would want to work with a firm like yours for the fractional CFO part of things, how might you engage with them? Or even a more extreme case, they’re coming to the US for the first time. How would an engagement look from your side?
Greg: 25:47
Yeah, so I’ll take the former right. Let’s say they’re well one. I’m a dual citizen, so I’m US-UK, so I can do work both sides of the Atlantic. I haven’t yet. So whoever’s listening, please call. But if you’ve got a, let’s say you’re operating out of London and you’ve got a sales presence here, you’ve got one person selling product, If you were looking to turn that sales organization that’s here into a business, an entity, into you know, a P&L responsibility and not just a single person sort of on a territory, I would be a great person to work with because I’ve got a network of HR people of obviously finance people. I’m great at operations so I could help that client turn their one person or two person marketing or sales team into an actual US-based organization that’s a subsidiary of the international headquarters and again have relationships with the legal teams and the accountants and all the things that you would require. I’ve got relationships with and trusted relationships that I’ve built over many, many years, so that would be a good illustration.
Cameron: 27:01
And I remember when I was based in Europe you have an obligation as a foreign-owned company, as a different tax filing, as a different obligation. There you would work with people and you wouldn’t do those filings, but you could point them in the direction of somebody who could help them with those kinds of aspects.
Greg: 27:16
That’s right and play the middle person right. So it’s yeah, we’ve selected XYZ CPA to help us with our foreign filings. You know your eight hours of phone difference. Why doesn’t Greg sort of take charge of the US bound things to do and report back? You know it allows, you know, the business management team to sort of stay focused on their business management. And then I would highlight what they needed to have their attention pointed to.
Cameron: 27:45
Okay, so again, similar theme that we’ve been hitting today is is you stick to your lane. You stick to your swim lane to keep your, your Ironman triathlon example working, but stick with what you do best. We will take care of the tax filing, the financials and, in my case, the marketing, the outreach. You go, run your business, that’s right. Stick with what you do best. I am going to ask you one last question, but before that I’m going to give you a chance to plug your website as well as the name of your podcast.
Greg: 28:15
Sure, so my website is blackburncapcom. That’s where we’re promoting and talking about financial management coaching and fractional CFO work. My podcast is more pointed towards this endurance leadership, so it’s called the Chief Endurance Leadership Podcast, and our guests tend to be entrepreneurs, business owners, olympians, paralymplympians, challenge athletes, leadership gurus, and really I’m trying to bring out this content around endurance leadership because I feel that my two worlds are going to combine at some point in their life, and either I’ve got clients in the endurance space that become guests of my show or vice versa. But those are the two sort of passion projects I have right now. They both get me smiling in the morning and it gives me an excuse to get on my bike on the weekends.
Cameron: 29:07
Have you had Michael Phelps on yet?
Greg: 29:09
Not yet.
Cameron: 29:10
That would be a huge win. Work on it. Well, here’s my last question for you, greg is in 20 years, you’re getting ready to retire and you’re inducted into the Fractional CFO Hall of Fame. What will they say about you at your induction speech?
Greg: 29:28
So I don’t think I’ll ever retire because I love what I do so much. And so it’s funny when I talk to my wife I say I’ve already retired, right, I don’t sit in that corporate cube anymore. That was many, many moons ago. I’ve already retired, right, I don’t sit in that corporate cube anymore. That was many, many moons ago. I’ve gone through the business cycles and so I feel like I’m almost in retirement, but I’m working full time. What they will say in that induction speech is that I really took the time to care about the companies and the people that I work with and I focused on educating them on the importance of financial management and the impact on their long-term financial success through their business. That I was a teammate, a partner, somebody who worked very well sort of one-on-one or one with the team. I wasn’t that type of person that just went into the dark and did the work and came back and produced. It was a really truly an impactful experience for the companies and people that I worked with.
Cameron: 30:27
Sounds pretty good to me. I could live with that. Greg McDonough of Blackburn Capital Advisors, thank you so much for joining us today. This has been America Open for Business. Thank you so much and join us next time. Thanks, Greg.
Greg: 30:41
Take care.
Narrator: 30:46
Thanks for listening to the America Open for Business podcast. We’ll see you again next time and be sure to click subscribe to get future episodes. Thank you.
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